#31
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Well said Keith.
There are many different way to accomplish a metal shaping project and get the desired result. How you get the surface information is not all that important. Filing, sanding or some other method that gives you the information is the only thing that counts. We all learn how to do things differently and what works for you is what you should use. There is more than one way to go to town and they are all correct.
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Joe Hartson There is more than one way to go to town and they are all correct. |
#32
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There are many, many different files and also the number of teeth/inch. If there is enough interest, we can have a seminar at DixieLand in a couple weeks. I'll add that filing on steel is much different than aluminum. With aluminum, you can remove material very quickly...too quickly in some situations and I can show some places in the roadster where I got carried away with the file to the detriment of the panel.
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Kerry Pinkerton |
#33
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Working with a Vixen file is like most opperations , You have to use your head .It is no different than using the incorrect sander for achieving the same results . If you start with an ill fitting weld seam you are setting yourself up for failure . The file is a great tool for only picking up the raised areas . That being said ,if you have an area that you have made no reasonable attempt to straightening out , then what will the file do except thin out metal that should not be .
Working with Cass Nawroki I was shown many ways to achieve ammasing results for surface prep . He mostly used the files for aluminum , but used them when needed for steel . His go to tool is a 8" grinder that he claims to be able to perform (Heart Surgery) with .Who am I to question . After being used to using a 3" and 4 " angle grinders ,I thought my God I will tear this thing to shreads . Wrong , It works similar to the concept of the Vixen where it only sees high spots , and just glides over the smooth surfaces . As you first try this you will see a shower of sparks coming off the surface and assume you are ruining the panel , only to find out you are only cutting the pride of the weld . This is where you have to use your head and stop and check your surface to see if you have undue highs and lows . Now on flat areas a straight line sander or Vixen used with Dycem to read the panel will 'work very good for this but on reverses and high crowns I would say the 8" grinder works great . Again there is a learning curve with any tool or method and if you want to ruin a panel quickly just take that grinder and burn an edge .USE YOUR HEAD
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Dan Pate Last edited by route56wingnut; 09-10-2012 at 07:44 AM. |
#34
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Years ago I visited Bart Holland restorations in Holland, they had a Mercedes Gullwing in that had just been 'Restored' somewhere in the US They were in the process of taking the new paint job off the car and the amount of filler was horrendous, they had run a grinder into the filler on the nose cone area and it was at least three-quarters of an inch thick. The customer was paying for it to be done again. I have the photos somewhere. The car was worth around a million I believe at the time. I think it had history. No excuse for it not to be done right. David
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Metalshaping DVD. www.metalshapingzone.com Metalshaping with hand tools on youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IGElSHzm0q8 All things are possible. |
#35
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I agree why are people confrontational in threads that are simply a discussion?. David
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Metalshaping DVD. www.metalshapingzone.com Metalshaping with hand tools on youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IGElSHzm0q8 All things are possible. |
#36
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My Process is to planish the area checking with my hands, file to find further high and low spots which are then planished out, then (sometimes) use an eight inch grinder to take out any final imperfections. David
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Metalshaping DVD. www.metalshapingzone.com Metalshaping with hand tools on youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IGElSHzm0q8 All things are possible. |
#37
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Realistically however, the majority of our members have very rudimentary skills. Anything they can learn that improves the quality of their work is worth the bother imo. I look back at some of my earlier work and cringe but the last thing we need to do is discourage new folks in their attempt to improve. It's one thing to show successes and beautiful work. It's another to show our mistakes but that is where learning happens not only for us but for the folks that read our stuff. I love it when folks show their work and honestly ask for opinions. That's where learning happens. The purpose of this forum is to share knowledge and grow our skills not just have debates. Everyone has to start somewhere. We're not born full grown metal shapers although it is very clear to me that some people have natural gifts. Some can sing, speak, draw, etc. And some can look at a piece of metal and see what needs to happen to get it to look like they want it to. Others can rub their hands over a panel and feel the highs and lows that are completely invisible to mere mortals. Yep, magic happens during commercials! If I buy that cream that takes removes body hair, I too can have my panels painted by the time the order is processed....
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Kerry Pinkerton |
#38
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Kerry you seem to have got the wrong end of the stick, I have taught enough people to know this is not the easiest thing to learn, I am talking about the attitude that some seem to have that it does not need to be planished out and that the job is finished once the welding is done. Bike tanks that have the bottom welded in before the rest of the tank has been fully welded for example. Not the person who puts his or her all into it and does not get perfect results. If I were that critical I dont think I would have lasted long as a lecturer. I have an opinion that the best way to find the high and low spots is with a body file that is why they were invented, others may not agree with this but I am entitled to my opinion. I am not forcing it on anyone just stating it.
David
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Metalshaping DVD. www.metalshapingzone.com Metalshaping with hand tools on youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IGElSHzm0q8 All things are possible. |
#39
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I think all of the folks in here do the best they can, I also believe that all of the folks in here aspire to improve there skills. Seeing beautifully shapes panels give me the incentive to try harder and improve my skills, seeing magnificent metal finished products makes me more determined to improve further and shoot for the goal of perfect metal work.. Im still miles away from that goal but I see improvements.... spattered with massive disapointment, but seeing the cracking work performed here and how most folk improve is often enough to gee me up and do as well as I can.
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Ian |
#40
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Ian, if you read my original post I did not actually refer to this forum at all. However to make it clear again it is better to have tried and failed than never to have tried at all. I applaud people who try to do this for a hobby and some get fantastic results, most do amazingly well.
David
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Metalshaping DVD. www.metalshapingzone.com Metalshaping with hand tools on youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IGElSHzm0q8 All things are possible. |
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