#11
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Also depends on the alloy of the rod if any. I use 1100 rod on my roadster and have never had a crack in spite of some heavy working. When I was using 41xx rod I had cracks. If you can shear some of the material you're working thin enough it will make fine rod.
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Kerry Pinkerton |
#12
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I gas weld because I don't have a decent tig setup yet. Alot of the mig and tig people will talk about minimizing distortion. Like Marty was talking about with his f-100 box, you get used to working with the heat affected zone (haz). I don't care what you use to weld the panels will pull. The more you weld and work the haz the better you get. You can plan for it like Marty. If I buy a tig, it will be for frames and exotic metal welding.
The flame torch has worked for alot of people for alot of years. I learned to use it from my Dad about 30 years ago, and I am still learning. Besides welding the torch is one of the best tools you can have in a shop. Loosening nuts and bolts, cutting, welding, bending and even heat treating. I can't even imagine not having a torch in the shop.... Jeff |
#13
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yes that video is part of the reason for my question.
I'm not to confident I could tig weld a panel, and put that much shape in it post weld. maybe I'm wrong? I have heard of using a strip of the original metal/alloy for filler. guess I'll have to give it a try |
#14
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Yioutube video
That video is as good as it gets ! I'm up to my f***king knees in test pieces.
"Tig weld then anneal simple approach for any hopeless flame welder. |
#15
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Which is better tig or gas? the difference is very little for welding steel. I use gas most of the time because I can pick it up and weld without having to wear much protective gear or worry about earth clamps etc. I dont think there is very much difference in the amount of distortion caused if it is done in the right way. I have found the results are much the same so it is a matter of personal preference. Both methods will result in a malleable weld that can be dressed out easily.
When it comes to Ally I think that Gas is the better method for making body panels where you want to butt weld the sections and then dress to a metal finish. The weld dresses out easily and if done correctly little grinding or sanding of the weld is needed. The Kent white footage shows how strong the weld is. In my footage you can see into the weld and see what is going on inside the flame. With Gas welding you have to move a bit quicker than with tig, you can't use the stop start process but the skills are more or less the same and with a little practice anyone who can tig will be able to gas and vice versa. I believe that mig has its uses and I have seen some of the work produced by Randy and Johnny and I think it is incredible to get a finish like they do. I use mig for plug welding and for butt welding some parts on a corner. It really is horses for courses.
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Metalshaping DVD. www.metalshapingzone.com Metalshaping with hand tools on youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IGElSHzm0q8 All things are possible. |
#16
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David on the MIG welding I totally agree it is not the preferred way to do it and don't think I have never cracked a weld.
If it is all you have you can make it work. I think the key is to make sure you have a perfect fit up to start off with. Then keep up with the planishing as you go. That will cut down on how much planishing you will have to do.The less hammering the better. Now that I do have a tig welder and a understanding on how to re-stretch a distorted panel, I have just been welding it up and plashing the weld afterward. Like you have been telling me. On a low crown like a hood I still would weld in one inch increments. If I was to do that with a mig welded panel I can almost guarantee a cracked weld.
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Johnny Arial This forum is dedicated to Metal Shaping. Please stay on topic. |
#17
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I've been thinking about the whole mig, tig, or torch welding debate and one thought occured to me. I learned with the torch, but before I mastered it Dad picked up a wirefeed and it took over. You could weld with alot less distortion, and it worked good. Next we had a tig. That was the best all around welding method (my opinion) and had even less distortion. It took way less time finishing the weld.
Now I have the wire welder and a torch for sheetmetal. I use the torch for sheetmetal, and the wire welder for structure. Here is where I'm going with this. If you learn to weld panels with the torch and finish them out you really start understanding what is going on when you put heat to a panel. I'm not afraid to grab the torch and start shrinking like I used to be. I learned how to set the panel up to make the weld work in my favor (if I'm lucky). It's a time thing sure, you want less distortion in a panel because it's less work. I just feel sometimes people get real carried away going to great lengths avoiding distortion. Is it to the point people can't read panels as well and don't know how to deal with it? Jeff |
#18
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Gas welding alluminum
Sorry wrong heading, should be tig vs gas welding
If your finished panel requires 3 individual pieces for example and all you need to to do is weld the butt joints. Then tig welding would be the best way to go. (If you have one) Raising any lows or reducing any highs will definately not crack a tig weld. With the right settings and technique you can lay a very flat bead that requires little dressing. OR If you have access to the backside tig there ... then all you will have on top is a small amount of penetration to dress. Especially with tig its best not to have any gaps at weld area. My 2 cents Regards, Don
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Never give up on what you want to achieve Last edited by LooseDuece; 03-13-2010 at 12:43 AM. |
#19
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Hi Don, does this mean you have given up on learning to gas weld Ally?.
tig welding is easy enough if you are working at a bench but when working on a car gas is far less cumbersome. For many the cost of an AC/DC tig would be prohibative.
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Metalshaping DVD. www.metalshapingzone.com Metalshaping with hand tools on youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IGElSHzm0q8 All things are possible. |
#20
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Hi David,
I haven't given up, I will post some pic's when I get my desired result. Whether u use gas tig or mig or during grinding ... one things for sure do not breath any fumes especially from the alluminum welding process. Do not underestimate the long term effects of these toxins that are given off. Alluminum intake is linked to alzhiemers and many other welding related diseases. Google the subect. A cheap method to filtering is a norton 7000 series silicon respirator mask with ABEK 1 P3 rating these are very effective and the cartriges are quite short to fit under your welding mask if your tig welding for example Sorry for going off thread topic. Regards, Don
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Never give up on what you want to achieve |
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