All MetalShaping

Go Back   All MetalShaping > General Metal Shaping Discussion > Basic questions and answers
  Today's Posts Posts for Last 7 Days Posts for Last 14 Days  

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 06-16-2014, 06:40 PM
longyard longyard is offline
MetalShaper of the Month September 2013
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Winston-Salem, NC
Posts: 1,083
Default Another Lead Question

I'm replacing some panels on a '57 Alfa Giulietta and the owner wants to keep the cost down, and speed up the restoration. He's taking the car from another shop that's bungled the work so far and now he's into the car for more money and time than he had originally planned.

There are a few pin hole rust throughs in the sheet metal above the grille. None larger than 1/8" (3mm). I've considered forming a new piece, and estimate a day's work to do it. The owner would rather I just skim it with Bondo and hope for the best. I won't do a Bondo repair and I've told him so. I might try a lead repair.

My question is: Am I right in thinking that lead would form a better repair into these pin holes, or is that wishful thinking? Don't have any pictures as the car is not yet in my shop.

Thanks for any suggestions.
__________________
Bill Longyard
Winston-Salem, NC
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 06-16-2014, 07:05 PM
MP&C's Avatar
MP&C MP&C is offline
MetalShaper of the month Feb.-11, July - 2018, Sept. 2020
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Leonardtown, MD
Posts: 1,707
Default

Regardless of how much he has dumped in it so far, it wasn't paid to you. If he wants a skim of bondo, I'd tell him to take it back where it was. Sounds like it needs a new panel..
__________________
Robert

Instagram @ mccartney_paint_and_custom

McCartney Paint and Custom YouTube channel
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 06-16-2014, 07:52 PM
Kerry Pinkerton's Avatar
Kerry Pinkerton Kerry Pinkerton is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Near Huntsville, Alabama. Just south of the Tennessee line off I65
Posts: 8,321
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MP&C View Post
Regardless of how much he has dumped in it so far, it wasn't paid to you. If he wants a skim of bondo, I'd tell him to take it back where it was. Sounds like it needs a new panel..
I agree. It will be your name he throws out when someone asks who did the repair. If you're not willing to accept the results, don't do the work.
__________________
Kerry Pinkerton
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 06-16-2014, 08:35 PM
Irrational Metalworks Irrational Metalworks is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Combine Tx.
Posts: 150
Default

The best advice has been given already! When a guy wants me to cut corners, I cut the job off. Plenty of shops can sling mud, not a lot can do quality work. A days labor to fix something right the first time is inexpensive!
__________________
Tim Young @ www.irrationalmetalworks.com
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 06-16-2014, 10:08 PM
crystallographic crystallographic is offline
MetalShaper of the Month October '14 , April '16, July 2020, Jan 2023
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Western Sierra Nevadas, Badger Hill, CA
Posts: 4,388
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by longyard View Post
I'm replacing some panels on a '57 Alfa Giulietta and the owner wants to keep the cost down, and speed up the restoration. He's taking the car from another shop that's bungled the work so far and now he's into the car for more money and time than he had originally planned.

There are a few pin hole rust throughs in the sheet metal above the grille. None larger than 1/8" (3mm). I've considered forming a new piece, and estimate a day's work to do it. The owner would rather I just skim it with Bondo and hope for the best. I won't do a Bondo repair and I've told him so. I might try a lead repair.

My question is: Am I right in thinking that lead would form a better repair into these pin holes, or is that wishful thinking? Don't have any pictures as the car is not yet in my shop.

Thanks for any suggestions.
Bill,
It's not what's on top of the work that bothers me but what is lurking behind. If you can soda blast in behind the panel and get a look at it, you may find that a couple of pinholes are deep and the rest are halfway. In these marginal-to-replace cases I'm careful to get a good analysis of the metal. If it's just a couple of spots in a complicated panel then I can spot-braze the holes, tin over the area, and solder it all up. Then go behind the work and apply an etching non-sanding primer, something tough and durable to seal all of the misery back there. Then move on to the next issue.

I've watched my metalwork age over 30 years, in the weather and on the roads. I feel comfortable knowing that a 30-year lifespan is kinda long in human ownership, and if they really wanted a permanent rust-proof situation they coulda bought a stainless Ford or a Weymann body.
__________________
Kent

http://www.tinmantech.com

"All it takes is a little practical experience to blow the he!! out of a perfectly good theory." --- Lloyd Rosenquist, charter member AWS, 1919.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 06-16-2014, 10:31 PM
longyard longyard is offline
MetalShaper of the Month September 2013
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Winston-Salem, NC
Posts: 1,083
Default

Kent White Opined:
"If it's just a couple of spots in a complicated panel then I can spot-braze the holes, tin over the area, and solder it all up. Then go behind the work and apply an etching non-sanding primer, something tough and durable to seal all of the misery back there."

Thanks Kent. I was hoping there was another course and this could be it. Yes, I can soda blast behind the panel as the engine bay is stripped and engine out. Would you explain to me what you mean by "tin" and "solder"? I'm weak on these skills other than electrical soldering and only kind of understand tinning. I've got a 200 watt soldering iron.

"... if they really wanted a permanent rust-proof situation they coulda bought a stainless Ford or a Weymann body."

I saw several of the Ford stainless cars at the Crawford Museum in Cleveland a few months ago!
__________________
Bill Longyard
Winston-Salem, NC
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 06-17-2014, 11:23 AM
David Gardiner David Gardiner is offline
MetalShaper of the Month
May 2009, Jan 2012, Dec 2014
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: England
Posts: 5,325
Default

Bill, if it really is a couple of pin holes and you are prepared to do a quick repair you might be better off filling them with a mig welder. Keep it cool and you should not have too much bondo to put over it. If you start brazing and trying to lead load when you have no experience of lead you will probably spend the day on it and end up with a mess.

David
__________________
Metalshaping DVD. www.metalshapingzone.com
Metalshaping with hand tools on youtube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IGElSHzm0q8

All things are possible.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 06-17-2014, 12:24 PM
Maxakarudy Maxakarudy is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Origin of the wheel, UK
Posts: 630
Default

Bill,
If can get the metal clean enough to tin, then lead would be ok as quick fix, it should last a lot longer than a bondo repair. If you are as skilled as David you could mig it, but you might end up chasing the weld around until you find some decent metal to weld to.
__________________
Cheers
Martin

No matter how clever you think you are, stupidity is always one step ahead!!!!
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 06-17-2014, 12:40 PM
David Gardiner David Gardiner is offline
MetalShaper of the Month
May 2009, Jan 2012, Dec 2014
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: England
Posts: 5,325
Default

If its that bad it needs a new panel Martin. To lead load over pin holes it will at least be necessary to tap the pin holed area low so you have somewhere to put the lead. I have never had much luck leading over holes.

David
__________________
Metalshaping DVD. www.metalshapingzone.com
Metalshaping with hand tools on youtube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IGElSHzm0q8

All things are possible.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 06-17-2014, 01:20 PM
Maxakarudy Maxakarudy is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Origin of the wheel, UK
Posts: 630
Default

Biil,
We need pictures!!
__________________
Cheers
Martin

No matter how clever you think you are, stupidity is always one step ahead!!!!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:23 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.