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  #111  
Old 09-30-2009, 08:27 AM
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Kerry Pinkerton Kerry Pinkerton is offline
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Good eye Richard. The bottom of the left fender actually sits 1/2" lower in this photo because the inner fender isn't installed and the bottom is not yet finished. The inner fender pulls the droopy bottom up.

There is a flat spot on the top of the right fender that I will bump up also. I spend half my time measuring....If I only had a buck

Peter, Superleggera is Italian for "Super Light". Normally this means there is a subframe of small metal (aluminum or steel) tubes that the body is welded or riveted to. This provides structure for the body which is then bolted or welded to the actual chassis. Here is a photo of a superleggera substructure.

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The Kirkham Cobra that is shown in the build manual posted a few days back is also of Superleggera construction.
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  #112  
Old 09-30-2009, 08:42 AM
David Gardiner David Gardiner is offline
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Kerry, all the superleggera cars I have worked on have had steel tube frames, but these have mostly been Aston Martins.

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  #113  
Old 09-30-2009, 09:03 AM
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David, you're right. I corrected the earlier post.

I know the Kirkhams have a CNC bender but I'm at a loss how the old timers made symmetrical 3 dimensional curves in tubing...patience I suppose.
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  #114  
Old 09-30-2009, 03:05 PM
David Gardiner David Gardiner is offline
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Kerry dont laugh, I bend the tube over my knee, You can also cut plywood to the shape and form the tube around that. The tube is small diameter heavy wall so it bends easily.

I think the Kirkhams used stainless tube I didnt read the text but I saw markings on the tiube and they polished it. (I could be wrong)

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  #115  
Old 09-30-2009, 06:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kerry Pinkerton View Post
David, you're right. I corrected the earlier post.

I know the Kirkhams have a CNC bender but I'm at a loss how the old timers made symmetrical 3 dimensional curves in tubing...patience I suppose.
On the 1 superleggera (aston) I worked on the tubing was not all that symmetrical.
Tubing left and right varied 1/2 to 1 inch . welding was relatively crude.

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  #116  
Old 09-30-2009, 06:20 PM
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"Superleggera" originated from Touring of Milan -- famous Italian Coachbuilder. Bodywork style was used by them (and other coachbuilders) for racecars to build moderately lightweight bodywork. Steel structure consisting of tubes or flanges to create a support system for the bodywork. Bodywork then usually done in aluminum that is then crimped around, riveted or screwed to the subframe. Works well. You see a lot of the 30's era Alfa racecars and 50's era Ferrari's with this "Superleggera" branded coachwork.

Perks: lightweight, easy to build, easy to repair (relative statement!) and it tends to flex a bit and thus no cracking.

Negs: galvanic corrossion between aluminum/steel -- use paint, primers or felt/leather/whatever to create a barrier. Mostly never symmetrical! (most of the tubing was bent over knees / tables and thus neither side of the car matches) Coachbuilder can get pretty close with a bit of measurement and work. (I've seen Ferrari's where nothing matches side/side and even door openings up to 2in offset) Usually metalwork is .040 (or thinner!) that after working is thin and a nightmare to fix today. A lot of rebodies are thus .050 or even 0.063 today.


As for Kerry's project? A labor of love. I knowingly have tried to steer him towards more of a superleggera style bodywork over bucks. I think it would have been easier and faster. (given my personal experiences over the years) But my major concern is hopefully one that won't happen or affect him -- support of the big body panels and "flex" of the chassis while driving. (and it's subsequent forces applied to the aluminum coachwork)
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  #117  
Old 09-30-2009, 10:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Superleggera View Post
"...As for Kerry's project? A labor of love. I knowingly have tried to steer him towards more of a superleggera style bodywork over bucks. I think it would have been easier and faster. (given my personal experiences over the years) But my major concern is hopefully one that won't happen or affect him -- support of the big body panels and "flex" of the chassis while driving. (and it's subsequent forces applied to the aluminum coachwork)
And I appreciate your advice and guidance more than you know. I share your concern about chassis flex. When I take the body off to prep for paint, I'm going to reinforce the chassis by adding a 2x2 to the existing 3x2 frame. The way I built the floor I can do that without raising the body.

Obviously, if I were starting over I'd do things differently but since I'm approaching end, I guess I'll not start over now..

That said, I have two sons and I'm probably going to build another car if I ever finish this one. The next one might be a coupe version of the roadster but superleggera, interesting inline 6 cylinder, space frame, full buck, tube frame, etc.
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  #118  
Old 09-30-2009, 10:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Kerry Pinkerton View Post
That said, I have two sons and I'm probably going to build another car..
The problem you will have also: you can never buy an existing car again that somebody already created or is mass produced (except for daily transportation) -- especially knowing you can build a one-off unique special that nobody else has. It really is an incurable disease to be honest... (and I know I have an bad case of it!)
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  #119  
Old 10-02-2009, 02:07 AM
Peter Miles Peter Miles is offline
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Would the original Maserati Birdcage cars be considered an example of this type of construction or was their's primarily for the chassis structure?

http://www.autocult.com.au/Image.aspx?id=9233
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  #120  
Old 10-02-2009, 11:10 PM
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More progress...still working on the rear of the car. The center of the back fit really well but I was unable to do the very complicated edge tip on the decklid so I chose to do it in several pieces. I cut back the top edge and welded in the center.

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Then I shaped the right corner and tipped the edge.


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After a half hour of tweeking and fitting it was welded in.

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The other corner was the same process. The gaps came out nice but obviously there is a lot of grinding and bumping to do.

I realize this is not the 'best' way to do this but I'm in a thrash to get the metal done before Oblong. If I was taking my time, I'd finish each weld seam before I did the next...

Also did some work on the lower left corner. The bottom had too much crown so I cut out some metal and welded it up.

I'm quickly running out of time but I'd like to have all the fenders roughed out. The only major thing left to do is the lower left front.

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These shouldn't be too hard...famous last words.

I'm bringing a bunch of bumping stuff...vixen files, dollies, slappers, etc. I picked up some large jack stands today so the car will not be on the ground while we work on it. Not as good as having it on a lift but much better than trying to sit on the concrete floor. I don't do that anymore. Something about old age and arthritis.

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Got word today that Jaypags and Ron Yeager are coming to Oblong. Jay expressed an interest in working on the roadster. Since Jay works at Warp Factor 7, he'll probably have the fenders ready for paint by the 3rd day.
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