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Old 04-11-2013, 11:36 PM
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thingsthatfly2 thingsthatfly2 is offline
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Default I'm in over my head again...

..and Im loving every minuet of it!

A local shop called me for some help on a restoration they are doing. a jag 140. The wife and I cruised over to see how we could help we were handed the following panel and asked to duplicate it. the one on the top left.

I knew it would be a fun part to work on this morning, I started with the bottom piece and some 20 gauge to see where i wanted to stretch and shrink. once i figured out my "order of operations" wheel, tuck shrink, hand planish, wheel, trim, fold, trim, wheel, trim, wheel. I moved on to making the part of out some of the 19 gauge draw quality steel that was graciously given to me! this was the second piece of the steel I have used and its benifits are noticeable to even a novice like myself!


here is my part and the original side by side. here you can see the tooling marks from my tipping wheel on the jenny. I would like to get a set of lower anvils that are all flat with a sharp edge and a rounded edge and get them in 3/4" thickness, 1.5" thickness and 3" thickness. I really think the thin one would help clean up lines like that.


i used one of those rolocs for cleaning gaskets as a super small shrinking disk on the right side here. worked well to compare to the side i had not done yet.

Well the customer was happy with it! so happy he brought me more and i could not say no! ever since following pugsy's thread on his fender i have wanted to do one!

well there are 2. I do not know much about these fenders. I know what they are going on but need some help identifying them.


they are in rough shape...


really rough shape...


this is how wide i need to make them.


I think i will attack the flange first. attach the panel to a flat piece of sheet metal and start making a new flange.


clamped them together to see how far off they are from each other..
...as you can see one is peaked the other is not..


the fronts are in bad shape too!

I need to widen these in an aesthetically appealing way! also this has many other chalenges to overcome like the wire edging, fitment to the rocker panels, and braces to replace the current set up.


I really cant wait to work on these!!
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Old 04-12-2013, 12:59 AM
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Joe Hartson Joe Hartson is offline
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Brent,
Here is a site you may be familiar with, carnut.com. Lot of pictures of cars.
http://www.carnut.com/photo/list/

The fenders might be 1940 Chevy pickup. Here is a link to one.
http://www.carnut.com/cgi-bin/02/ima...ra/nsra066.jpg
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Old 04-12-2013, 06:33 AM
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thingsthatfly2 thingsthatfly2 is offline
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Thanks joe! that is the fender! looks to me like one is overpeaked and the other is flattened some. the pitch of the fender is what will make the widening part hard.


great site... found this too.

the little bump at the bottom of the grille is what my smaller part we made is!
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Last edited by thingsthatfly2; 04-12-2013 at 06:36 AM.
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Old 04-12-2013, 06:59 AM
route56wingnut route56wingnut is offline
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Brent glad to see you were able to use the 19g . Are you finding it to be as user freindly in these compoud areas as I have ? Some say it is the thickness diference, but I am sold on the elastcity of the DQ .
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Old 04-12-2013, 07:29 AM
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Looks like you got some fun work coming in.

I'm looking forward to following along.
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http://www.allmetalshaping.com/showthread.php?t=154
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Old 04-12-2013, 03:36 PM
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Brent,

Thinking about widening the fenders. That is kinda tough with the peak.

If you try to keep the peak centered, you will need to insert a widening strip open each half. Sounds like a lot of seam work and then one has already been. "depeaked". Maybe just wheel ou the peak and widen them.

Second choice. Repeak the bad fender. Then add a strip into just the outer area. That might be a lopsided look at first thought, however, if you keep about the origina width at the rear and taper out the widest point at th opening center it may retain more of a lean look.


Do you have any modeling clay? Plain old child's clay from the drug store works to develop some shapes at smaller scales and gain some insight into the finished look.
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Last edited by Richard K; 04-12-2013 at 03:38 PM.
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Old 04-12-2013, 10:48 PM
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thingsthatfly2 thingsthatfly2 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by route56wingnut View Post
Brent glad to see you were able to use the 19g . Are you finding it to be as user freindly in these compoud areas as I have ? Some say it is the thickness diference, but I am sold on the elastcity of the DQ .
I played with one piece when i first got them. I really need to find a supplier for around my area. I was sold on the second piece.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 123pugsy View Post
Looks like you got some fun work coming in.

I'm looking forward to following along.
Thanks Pugsy! I only wish it could be as exciting and as informative as yours.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard K View Post
Brent,

Thinking about widening the fenders. That is kinda tough with the peak.

If you try to keep the peak centered, you will need to insert a widening strip open each half. Sounds like a lot of seam work and then one has already been. "depeaked". Maybe just wheel ou the peak and widen them.

Second choice. Repeak the bad fender. Then add a strip into just the outer area. That might be a lopsided look at first thought, however, if you keep about the origina width at the rear and taper out the widest point at th opening center it may retain more of a lean look.


Do you have any modeling clay? Plain old child's clay from the drug store works to develop some shapes at smaller scales and gain some insight into the finished look.
There inlies the problem that kept me laying awake. since the whole truck bed has been made larger I have thought of cutting the fender along the peak (after bumping them back to matching condition) and making either a roll (depeaked) or a peaked filler patch. I could emphasize the bulge or mute it out some. The filler panel will have to be made in about 3 parts just because of how my wheel is a bench top. I think it would be easier to work with and finagle each panel into shape. I hope to finish installing my paint booth this weekend so i can play with the fenders some and at least get the flanges corrected.
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Old 04-13-2013, 09:47 AM
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Steve Hamilton Steve Hamilton is offline
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Default make the fender wider

Brent

Well you did jump into the deep end of the pool !!!!!!!

To add a filler strip the full length of the fender requires 2 weld zones the full length also, and probably a couple joints in the filler too. That can be a real challenge to keep all the weld shrinkage under control. It will work and has been done by many in the past. I'm sure you could do it that way too but since you use mig welding that is even more difficult.

Another option that you could consider would be to make a new inner half of the fender, and then only one long weld zone, and maybe two short seams so you could make managable size parts. You should probably also make a buck to keep everything where it is supposedto be.

The new panel would have the mount flange, then a wider section to the crease, and the crease, and extra metal beyond the crease. So the weld would be to the outside of the crease.

Both ways are a lot of work.

I hope you didn't give the customer a quote, or you may be working for free on part of the job.
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Old 04-13-2013, 10:25 AM
Doug M Doug M is offline
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Default

Did I hear you say you had to redo the flange as well as add width to the fenders, then you'll have 3 full length welds. As Steve suggests you can cut down on the welds by doing the flange to center with flange in one piece including the flange.

You might fab then tack the new wider flange part to the original to see how they fit before any cutting. a set of 2" standoffs, flange to flange, would allow you to use the originals as a a buck, and you might wheel the crown part to shape with your bench wheel, little reach required.

Can you turn the wheels yokes 90*?

Can you get a profile from a "good" fender for the flange
(for fit) and crown to match?

Nice projects. The Jag nose looks to be well along in process.
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Old 04-16-2013, 07:41 AM
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thingsthatfly2 thingsthatfly2 is offline
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Hamilton View Post
Brent

Well you did jump into the deep end of the pool !!!!!!!

To add a filler strip the full length of the fender requires 2 weld zones the full length also, and probably a couple joints in the filler too. That can be a real challenge to keep all the weld shrinkage under control. It will work and has been done by many in the past. I'm sure you could do it that way too but since you use mig welding that is even more difficult.

Another option that you could consider would be to make a new inner half of the fender, and then only one long weld zone, and maybe two short seams so you could make managable size parts. You should probably also make a buck to keep everything where it is supposedto be.

The new panel would have the mount flange, then a wider section to the crease, and the crease, and extra metal beyond the crease. So the weld would be to the outside of the crease.

Both ways are a lot of work.

I hope you didn't give the customer a quote, or you may be working for free on part of the job.
Thankfully I told him by the hour! Thank you for all your advice! I hope to get some time real soon to work on it again!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug M View Post
Did I hear you say you had to redo the flange as well as add width to the fenders, then you'll have 3 full length welds. As Steve suggests you can cut down on the welds by doing the flange to center with flange in one piece including the flange.

You might fab then tack the new wider flange part to the original to see how they fit before any cutting. a set of 2" standoffs, flange to flange, would allow you to use the originals as a a buck, and you might wheel the crown part to shape with your bench wheel, little reach required.

Can you turn the wheels yokes 90*?

Can you get a profile from a "good" fender for the flange
(for fit) and crown to match?

Nice projects. The Jag nose looks to be well along in process.
I was thinking of doubling up the flange. make a nice part and spot weld it on. then i could fix all the cracks and weld those up and make it all smooth. where can I find a larger profile gauge? making them out of sheet metal or cardboard is time consuming.

No i cant turn my upper wheel 90*

I really hope to cut down on weld time. Thanks for the ideas on widening from the flange everyone!
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